Tuesday, May 18, 2010

William Webster Responds to Beckwith’s "Return to Rome"


Why Scripture and the Facts of History Compel Me, a Former Roman Catholic, to Remain a Committed Evangelical Protestant A Response to Frank Beckwith’s, Return to Rome by William Webster

11 comments:

bkaycee said...

WOW! Should be a mandatory read for anyone dipping their toe in the Tiber.

Succinct, clear, and factual. An honest, respectful assessment, stated in unambiguous terms.
Irrefutable.

Soli De Gloria

Truth Unites... and Divides said...

Has anyone come from out of an Eastern Orthodox background and written a post about staying as a committed conservative Protestant instead of taking the bus to Constantinopole?

Joe said...

Quoting Mr Whitaker (in his conclusion),

Jesus warned the men of his day to beware of an authority whose teachings contradicted the written word of God in its tradition. He said to men, ‘He who has ears to hear let him hear’, as He called men to reject the teachings of those who ‘sat on Moses seat.’

Where does Jesus call men to reject the teachings of those who 'sat on Moses seat'?

I read in Matt 23:2

The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat. So you must obey them and do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do..."?

But isn't this different than what Mr. Whitaker is saying? Jesus is not saying to reject their teachings...he is saying to reject their actions because they do not actually line up with the teachings - hence hypocrites.

In Him,

Joe

Ken said...

Joe,
Jesus also warned against the teaching of the Jewish leaders who claimed to interpret the law of Moses rightly, but did not.

Matthew 16:11-12

"How is it that you do not understand that I did not speak to you concerning bread? But beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees."

Then they understood that He did not say to beware of the leaven of bread, but of the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees.

When they "sat in Moses seat" and taught wrong, Jesus condemned their teachings - as in Matthew 15 and Mark 7.

Joe said...

Hi Ken.

Then they understood that He did not say to beware of the leaven of bread, but of the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees.

When they "sat in Moses seat" and taught wrong, Jesus condemned their teachings - as in Matthew 15 and Mark 7.


Yea...your right. Jesus certainly rebukes the Pharisee's "teaching" at times.

But I guess I am unclear as to what Jesus meant in Matt 23 when he says to obey everything they tell you to do because they sit in Moses seat. If he said, do everything they tell you when they are teaching correctly...that would be one thing, but of course in Matt 23, he does not give that qualification.

Matt 23 opens up with Jesus telling his disciples to do everything the Pharisee's tell them....but then goes on to rebuke their actions, and seemingly teachings as well throughout the entire chapter.

This is confusing to me. What things I wonder did Jesus have in mind that they were supposed to obey from them?

Thanks.

In Him,

Joe

Ken said...

Hi Joe,
Jesus is assuming that when they sit in the chair of Moses - they will read the law - the people were supposed to obey all the law; and it is assumed, if they interpret it right, then do it. He is focusing on the aspect of hypocrisy here - saying good things from the law, but not doing them.

"all" cannot mean everything they teach, because Jesus rebuked them in Matthew 15, Mark 7 and Matthew 16 and other places.

He is assuming that "all" they would say from the chair of Moses would be true - mostly reading the law, which is the word of God; and then an exhortation to do it.

This verse cannot be used to support a RC magisterium of "the chair of Peter", because the RCC is adding things to Scripture and doctrines, dogmas, and practices, and traditions.

When the Pharisees and scribes added things and taught wrong, they were rebuked, Matthew 16:12; Mark 7; Matthew 15.

Truth Unites... and Divides said...

Dr. Beckwith has written a critique of William Webster's review:

http://romereturn.blogspot.com/2010/05/new-review-of-return-to-rome.html

Joe said...

Hi Ken.

He is assuming that "all" they would say from the chair of Moses would be true - mostly reading the law, which is the word of God; and then an exhortation to do it.

This verse cannot be used to support a RC magisterium of "the chair of Peter", because the RCC is adding things to Scripture and doctrines, dogmas, and practices, and traditions.


Yea..in the end I do agree with your assessment.

Thanks.

In Him,

Joe

Francis J. Beckwith said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Francis J. Beckwith said...

Oops. I just posted the link to my sort-of reply, and then noticed it had been done by TUAD.

So, I deleted it.

Frank

James Swan said...

Dr. Beckwith,

What is your reasoning for turning off the comments for your review of Mr. Webster?