tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19795707.post6521767507800301820..comments2024-03-22T16:09:48.895-04:00Comments on Beggars All: Reformation And Apologetics: Luther: St. Augustine or St. Ambrosius cannot be compared with meJames Swanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16136781934797867593noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19795707.post-12965716288964639142023-10-21T15:34:03.483-04:002023-10-21T15:34:03.483-04:00Luther has no right to compare himself to a bishop...Luther has no right to compare himself to a bishop for he was not one. There are and have been good bishops and bad bishops. Luther’s issue was pride and he liked to think that his intellect was superior to others including the historical Church Jesus himself founded. Look at his remarks about the peasants of Germany when they wouldn’t follow him and covert to Lutheranism or the Jews- he advocated to kill them all. - irrefutable. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19795707.post-73542055435488208712010-10-25T12:14:24.516-04:002010-10-25T12:14:24.516-04:00Dr. King, is it true that the orthodox Greek fathe...<i>Dr. King, is it true that the orthodox Greek fathers (that is, Origen excepted) could not read Hebrew?</i><br /><br />1) First of all, I do not hold a doctorate. I don't want anyone to be misled in this respect - My formal education rises no higher than a Masters of Divinity degree.<br /><br />2) I concur with the web site you posted - I am only aware of two ECFs who knew Hebrew, Origen and Jerome.dtkinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08517142528948228472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19795707.post-5430208588353544462010-10-25T02:02:23.820-04:002010-10-25T02:02:23.820-04:00It's claimed here:
http://hebrewgospel.com/Di...It's claimed here:<br /><br />http://hebrewgospel.com/Disappearance%20Hebrew%20Matthew%20Gospel.php<br /><br />"But suppose the Hebrew Gospel continued several centuries in existence, yet, if we except Origen and Jerome, perhaps none of the fathers, who have spoken of this Gospel, were able to read it. The objection therefore applies chiefly, if not entirely to Origen and Jerome."<br /><br />Dr. King, is it true that the orthodox Greek fathers (that is, Origen excepted) could not read Hebrew?Viisaushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02682159289133730565noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19795707.post-80904436675281145572010-10-25T01:48:56.074-04:002010-10-25T01:48:56.074-04:00Did a quick web-search, and it seems that both EO-...Did a quick web-search, and it seems that both EO-traditionalist cranks and universalist heretics, basically all who have a beef with Augustinian theology, like to tout his ignorance of foreign languages:<br /><br />http://hellbusters.8m.com/upd20.html<br /><br />"6 Græcæ autem linguæ non sit nobis tantus habitus, ut talium rerum libris legendis et intelligendis ullo modo reperiamur idonei, (De Trin. lib III); and, et ego quidem græcæ linguæ perparum assecutus sum, et prope nihil. (Contra litteras Petiliani, lib II, xxxviii, 91. Migne, Vol. XLIII.) Quid autem erat causæ cur græcas litteras oderam quibus puerulus imbuebar ne nunc quidem mihi satis exploratum est: "But what was the cause of my dislike of Greek literature, which I studied from my boyhood, I cannot even now understand." Conf. I:13."Viisaushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02682159289133730565noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19795707.post-43742935465069357852010-10-25T01:35:32.285-04:002010-10-25T01:35:32.285-04:00Thank you, Dr. King. :)
It would actually quite u...Thank you, Dr. King. :)<br /><br />It would actually quite useful if you could compile for us some sort of list of which notable church fathers could read Hebrew (or who could not), and which Latin fathers could read Greek - that would put things to a perspective.Viisaushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02682159289133730565noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19795707.post-64442623813261557512010-10-25T00:22:32.972-04:002010-10-25T00:22:32.972-04:00This is one of the main reasons we should not feel...<i>This is one of the main reasons we should not feel overt respect for the interpretations of some primitive fathers, especially Latin ones: their elementary lack of learning in original languages.</i><br /><br />Neither Augustine nor Ambrose knew Hebrew. Augustine only began to study Greek toward the end of his life, but Ambrose (though also a Latin theologian) had a thorough education in Greek.<br /><br />But Ambrose informs us by his own testimony that he was only a novice when made the bishop of Milan...<br /><br /><b>Ambrose (c. 339-97):</b> I make no claims, of course, to the glory of the Apostles—whoever could, other than those whom the Son of God himself chose? Nor do I claim to have the grace of the prophets, or the power of the evangelists, or the vigilance of the pastors. My wish is only to attain to the attention and diligence towards the divine Scriptures which the apostle ranked last of all among the duties of the saints, This is all I desire, so that, in my endeavor to teach others, I might be able to learn myself. For there is only one true Master, who never had to learn all that he taught everyone else: in this he is unique. Ordinary men must learn beforehand what they are to teach, and receive from him what they are to pass on to others.<br /><b>In my own case, not even this was allowed. I was snatched into the priesthood from a life spent at tribunals and amidst the paraphernalia of administrative office, and I began to teach you things I had not learnt myself.</b> The result was that I started to teach before I had started to learn. With me, then, it is a matter of learning and teaching all at the same time, since no opportunity was given me to learn in advance. Ivor J. Davidson, <i>Ambrose, De Officiis</i> (Oxford: Oxford University Press, 2001), Book 1, Chapter 1, §3-4, p. 119.<br /><br /><i>Jerome was a rare exception among Latin fathers in his knowledge of Hebrew.</i><br /><br />True.dtkinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08517142528948228472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19795707.post-55019873112291743092010-10-24T21:57:53.557-04:002010-10-24T21:57:53.557-04:00Could either Ambrose or Augustine read the Holy Sc...Could either Ambrose or Augustine read the Holy Scriptures in their original Greek and Hebrew - like Luther could?<br /><br />http://www.glaird.com/luth-heb.htm<br /><br />This is one of the main reasons we should not feel overt respect for the interpretations of some primitive fathers, especially Latin ones: their elementary lack of learning in original languages.<br /><br />Jerome was a rare exception among Latin fathers in his knowledge of Hebrew.Viisaushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02682159289133730565noreply@blogger.com