Monday, July 07, 2008

World Youth Day Indulgence

Good news for Catholic Answers who recently promoted the World Youth Day project to protect their Catholic youth from "anti-Catholic Protestants" who "using clever but deceptive arguments for which the anti-Catholics are famous...get the reader to doubt many of our most important Catholic beliefs and practices". While dodging "radical anti-Catholics", Catholic youth may gain a plenary or partial indulgence for their participation.

20 comments:

Matthew Bellisario said...

Indulgences are the bomb! Wow, every post on here is something against the Church. We must be doing something right!

Richard Froggatt said...

We are the champions, my friend! :)

bkaycee said...

When did the RCC stop attaching time increments to their indulgences? Hey, if i'm going to put the effort in attending the rally, I want to know what denomination of purgatory relief, i'm working for.

DH (DumbHusband) said...

So the indulgences seem to be based on wealth. If you are wealthy enough to travel to Australia you get a bigger indulgence than the poor person who can't afford to go. That's nice. The person living in deepest Africa who doesn't even know the indulgence is available gets nothing. Of course maybe there is a partial-partial indulgence for those who didn't know there was an indulgence but would have indulged if they would have known there was an indulgence.

I guess that's fair. You can't just give this stuff to everyone.

kmerian said...

bkaycee, the time increments that used to be on indulgences disappeared about 40 years ago, because they are too often misunderstood has having something to do with purgatory, which they do not.

dh, you would do well to learn what an indulgence is and is not before you make comments like this.

bkaycee said...

Kmerian:

Would you consider the New advent encyclopedia authoritative?

"By a plenary indulgence is meant the remission of the entire temporal punishment due to sin so that no further expiation is required in Purgatory. A partial indulgence commutes only a certain portion of the penalty; and this portion is determined in accordance with the penitential discipline of the early Church. To say that an indulgence of so many days or years is granted means that it cancels an amount of purgatorial punishment equivalent to that which would have been remitted, in the sight of God, by the performance of so many days or years of the ancient canonical penance. "

"Nihil Obstat. F. Innocentius Apap, O.P., S.T.M., Censor. Theol.
Imprimatur. Edus. Canonicus Surmont, Vicarius Generalis. Westmonasterii.
APPROBATIO ORDINIS
Nihil Obstat. F. Raphael Moss, O.P., S.T.L. and F. Leo Moore, O.P., S.T.L.
Imprimatur. F. Beda Jarrett, O.P., S.T.L., A.M., Prior Provincialis Angliæ"

DH (DumbHusband) said...

Howdy kmerian (fellow Texas), you are quite right, there is so much I do not understand about Catholicism, however I am trying to learn.

As I understand it a plenary indulgence is the "the remission of the entire temporal punishment due to sin so that no further expiation is required in Purgatory." "A partial indulgence commutes only a certain portion of the penalty"
(source: NewAdvent.org)

According to the article: "For those unable to make the trip to Sydney..." you can only get a partial.

So it still sounds to me like those who live in a better "state" of life (more mobility, more wealth, better information, etc.) get the better deal. They have access to better indulgences... at least in this case.

DH (DumbHusband) said...

Ooops, (fellow Texan) :-)

Rhology said...

James Bellisario said:
We must be doing something right!

Yeah, like plenary indulgences applied to those who have the means to get to WYD while dodging radical anti-Catholics! Wow!

kmerian said...

Yes, and it says exactly what I did:

To say that an indulgence of so many days or years is granted means that it cancels an amount of purgatorial punishment equivalent to that which would have been remitted, in the sight of God, by the performance of so many days or years of the ancient canonical penance.

You see, it is not remitting days out of purgatory, an indulgence of, let's say, 100 days, would be the equivalent of 100 days of penance here on earth, not in purgatory

kmerian said...

Rho, the indulgence is available to everyone, not just those with the means to get to WYD from the article linked to in the post:

The plenary indulgence is also available to "all those who, wherever they are, will pray for the spiritual goals of this meeting and for its happy outcome."

The Dude said...

BTW there are many other plenary indulgences readily available to any Catholic in any place at any time. Just because certain people might not be able to take advantage of this one doesn't mean they have no other options.

Matthew Bellisario said...

Rhology said, "Yeah, like plenary indulgences applied to those who have the means to get to WYD while dodging radical anti-Catholics! Wow!"

Yeah, like the packed plate of food you eat every day when the kids in Africsa are starving. Life isn't fair is it?

Matthew Bellisario said...

By the way, there are many ways to obtain indulgences. But if you wish, one of you can always sponsor somenone in Africa to WYD since your so concerned about this.

Carrie said...

The plenary indulgence is also available to "all those who, wherever they are, will pray for the spiritual goals of this meeting and for its happy outcome."


Actually, it is unclear whether this is true as later in the article it says a partial indulgence is available to those who do not attend.

Carrie said...

Wow, every post on here is something against the Church. We must be doing something right!

Using that logic, I guess I can assume you keep commenting here because our posts against your church our threatening.

Just an FYI, all of my posts are on exposing the errors of Rome. It just happens to be my apologetic focus.

bkaycee said...

"it cancels an amount of purgatorial punishment equivalent to that which would have been remitted, in the sight of God,"

Sooooo, God decides the number of days and lets the Pope/magesterium know the correct amount or the Pope/magesterium decides the amount and lets God know?

Matthew Bellisario said...

Carrie says, "Using that logic, I guess I can assume you keep commenting here because our posts against your church our threatening. "

Not threatening in the slightest. The Church has had hecklers long before you and she still is bringing the faithful into union with God. Hecklers come and hecklers go, but the Church still marches on proclaiming the truth as she has done for about 2000 years now.

kmerian said...

bkaycee

It is written:
Whatever you shall loose on earth, will be loosed in Heaven.

Kendall said...

If an indulgence can be applied to those in purgatory--what does it do if it does not lessen time?

In older RC publications you would see: "An indulgence of 7 years. a plenary indulgence once a month under usual conditions when this litany is recited daily for a month."

Thank God for Colossians 1:22 He (Jesus) has now reconciled [you] in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and above reproach before him.

When death comes I will be absent from the body and present with the Lord (2 Cor. 5:6-8).